Ho hum

Tonight, friends [and for that matter, foes] off WWP gathered in Salem to rally for legislation that would create civil unions.

Ho, hum.

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but civil unions are and will not be on the the radar in Salem, not now or anytime soon, the posturing of WWP's many well-meaning friends and foes alike. Capitol sources say that the odds Speaker Karen Minnis will allow a vote on SB 1000 are so remote that its unlikelihood even outdistances the chances Pope Benedict XVI will convert to Islam. Simple reason: Minnis solidifies her position, and her base, by standing against civil unions. In fact, the more the protest, the better. It's thought that Minnis actually welcomed today's contretemps by Roey & Friends: After all, such a stance only strengthens Minnis' position among the only people who matter to her, the GOP base that keeps her in power. No one else figures into that equation, or ever will. Essentially everyone but Roey has figured that out.

But then, political science really isn't a strong suit at Basic Rights Oregon. Were that the case, would we be deluding ourselves today with the sheepish and sheeplike, ever-s0 politically correct pretense that the civil-unions legislation is worthy of praise when it's really little more than the 21st century version of the historically invalidated concept of "separate but equal"? But who can be surprised at BRO's failed, insider-starstruck record of failure so far? Almost on cue, BRO has misstepped, or overstepped, or failed to step -- so much so that one wonders if Roey Thorpe really isn't Kevin Mannix in drag. [Sorry, Kevin. No insult intended.] It's a textbook case for F***up -- to say nothing bout being a classic case of diarrheaic apologia cum strategy-on-the-fly. [One only needs to see the current edition of the perpetually offline Just Out for an example.]

Frankly, WWP would rather endure the present discrimination outright than enjoy the dubious liberties of the civil unions legislation purports to offer. That, at least, would provide a practical point of politics to argue from. Otherwise, it's bound to be a century of meaningless "separate but equal treatment." There's actually a history of that happening before, in case you didn't know.

It's Political Science 101. Really, Roey. You ought to try it.

Comments

[Gordie]

I'll have to admit, one thing I've been curious about is how many of our state's senators voted for civil unions just because they felt safe in knowing that it would never get through the house.

How does Roey stay in power?

[Bryan Harding]

WWP and Gordie - you are absolutely fucking pathetic. Tell me, what have you done to advance the gay rights movement here in Oregon other than sit around and bitch on blogs?

If you are so unsatisfied with the way in which things are being dealt with - what are you doing to make a change? NOTHING.

Gordie - do you even realize the amount of hate mail Senator Westlund and Morse received. There is even a repeal effort under way. You, in all honesty think that these men would not only vote for this bill, but sponsor this bill knowing full well the political ramifications? Give me a break.

You both are pathetic individuals.

-Bryan Harding
Gay Rights Watch

[Brian Kurth]

If Roey is Kevin Mannix in drag, then you are Oregion's version of Osama bin Laden hiding in a "cave" -- or in your case, behind your blog.

If you feel so strongly that change is not happening in the manner you feel is so crucial, then I suggest you grab a mitt and get in the game rather than being stuck way out in left field.

If you can do ANY better than Roey, Basic Rights Oregon, HRC, PFLAG and the other organizations, churches and affiliations that are teaming together under the common cause for change, then I suggest you forego your pot-shot blogging and put your money and time where your wide mouth is, come forward, and run for House/Senate in the next election on YOUR platform as you feel it is so much stronger.

Proof is in the pudding -- and the pudding is making positive change one step at a time -- NOT hiding in the shadows and blogging from some spare bedroom.

Brian Kurth

[Bryan Harding]

And while we're at it... How dare you personally attack Roey Thorpe. You have to realize that there is a much bigger strategy than is visible to the eyes. You think that BRO actually just does things on a whim - in hopes that they will get the desired result? Words cannot express what I want to say right now. Is your mind truly this small that you cannot comprehend all of this?

Do you not think that BRO is aware that Karen is the problem and that she does not want to budge? There are ways to get around this and BRO is working on every possible outlet to do so.

Keep on bitching from the sidelines Pablo and taking no personal action...

Bryan Harding

[Beckie Lee]

You are infuriating! You sit back and attack the people working to advance civil liberties instead of the hate mongers who are blocking attempts at advancing rights for Oregonians. People like Karen Minnis are extremely frustrating and hateful. But people like you are worse. You sit at a desk and attack the people who are working hard day and night to make Oregon a better place. We are extremely lucky to have people like Roey working hard for us. She is smart, saavy and has more dedication than you have in your little finger.

As a side note - here's some common sense 101 for you - every day that Karen Minnis has to defend the fact that she is not letting a vote on civil unions, one more person who was sitting on the fence on this issue comes to our side. Her position is indefensible - and the more she has to talk about it, the more the public realizes she is blocking the vote because she is anti-gay.

[LeLo]

“Almost on cue, BRO has misstepped, or overstepped, or failed to step -- so much so that one wonders if Roey Thorpe really isn't Kevin Mannix in drag. [Sorry, Kevin. No insult intended.]”

Wow, Pablo. As the recipient of several visits to my blog from you as “the oracle” correcting me or defending the name Dorcus (?!?!), I guess it’s time for me to do the same to you and ask if you really needed to take low blows on Roey? Did it make you feel better or something?

I, too, was at the rally, and unlike you, was excited by the amount of people, 800-1,000, that came from all over the state to be at our capital. I was excited to hear our governor declare so loudly and so firmly his support for us, and I was especially moved by Roey’s speech about not backing down, and continuing the fight. When Roey spoke, the crowd roared the loudest of the night. You know, it’s fine if you disagree with BRO and the approach, but taking personal potshots at Roey is pretty lame. And, you know, you could always be more than the oracle and actually do something. I know of plenty of GLBTQ projects that could use some help: let me know if you need some introductions or ideas of how to get involved.

[Reid Vanderburgh]

I don't consider myself a very politically savvy person when it comes to nuances and knowing the history of who supported who on some other bill and thus might be on someone else's side this time, etc. But I do understand that civil rights battles are incremental, and involve a series of steps, not one giant leap. I see SB 1000 as a step. Voting NO on it would be a step also - in the wrong direction. Not bringing it fora vote is also a step in the wrong direction. While not the bill I'd like to have seen up for a vote, while it is a compromise, at least it's a step in the RIGHT direction.

A diatribe against those who are on my side is also a step in the wrong direction. "Divide and conquer" has been a time-tested tactic of the politically-savvy. Those who buy into it are taking a step in the wrong direction.

Anyone who disagrees with BRO's stance and actions to this degree would be taking a step in the right direction by getting involved directly. Taking potshots is a waste of time. It accomplishes nothing other than diverting energy away from the task at hand, which is planning the next step - in the right direction.

Separate but equal was also a compromise. So was the 1918 constitutional amendement granting women the right to vote. All civil rights movements involve compromise as they take steps in the right direction, and this one is no exception.

[Stephen]

Pablo, please rethink your position. First, horrendous as "Separate but Equal" was, it was in fact a step above slavery. With the protection of children and families at stake, I think you need to consider what it means to them to "endure the present discrimination outright" rather than have at least some legal standing. And second, perhaps you yourself need a review of History 101, if you think a battle to change the fundamental laws (and views) of a state is "failed" because it hasn't succeeded in 3 or 4 years. This is truly a historic battle, and it will take a long time. Roey and BRO are in it for the long haul. Where are you?

[Lorna Townsend]

I am reminded of the parents who were sobbing about the closure of their schools because "they" were unfair and didn't care about the families--bla-bla-bla. The same parents were also seen talking to the media some time earlier about the unreasonable taxes, rising costs, and general spending of the school board. The new superintendent came up with a plan which she implemented. The crying parents had not submitted a plan, had not run for the school board, nor worked for a solution to a bad situation. Those who DO--even though it might seem to you like not enough--have way more respect coming than those who merely whine and complain. Shame on you for condemning Roey Thorpe who works so hard to affect change. Whining and criticizing is pathetic as a tool against hate and discrimination. It adds to the problem It does not solve it!

[Chuck Currie]

People who complain that Paul is just sitting behind a desk blogging have not spent much time with him. Over the years he has been active in various equality efforts and is one of the most important figures pushing the United Methodist Church towards fuller inclusion. First United Methodist Church of Portland (FUMC) – a congregation given BRO’s Profile in Courage Award in 2000 – is active in the anti-discrimination movement largely because of his leadership in the church. Paul will soon finish up a term as one of the elected lay leaders of FUMC. Who could have thought 10 or 15 years ago that an openly gay man would be elected to serve in such a prominent position in one of Portland’s historic churches? He won that trust because of his record of advocating for reconciliation and justice in the Christian community and the in the wider society. FUMC marches in the gay pride parade, has organized in the religious community against OCA ballot measures, and won the respect of the GLBT community because of his work there. How many fund raisers have I been forced to attend at his house or own his orders to support civil rights for our gay and lesbian brothers and sisters? He has certainly earned the right to question the leadership and tactics at BRO.

[Gordie]

Bryan, what makes you think I was restricting my comments to Republicans? What Westlund and Morse have done is brave.

I believe that fighting judgmental and intolerant folks by being judgmental and intolerant is a flawed strategy. It may sometimes help when it comes to gaining equality, but not acceptance.

[Bryan Harding]

Hasn't won my respect. Paul - call BRO. Tell them first hand. 503.222.6151

[Alisa A. Simmons]

Ho, hum? You've got to be f***in' kidding me! While others encourage you to join us on the frontlines for equality, I beg you to stay in cyberspace. Who knows how damaging your flawed strategies would be in the real world.

As a political/community organizer I have never seen a more strategic and well organized effort. We have the BEST political and organizing minds in Oregon building this movement. Do you honestly think you know better than the collective minds of BRO, the ACLU, PFLAG, etc.? Let me answer for you, "NO! You don't."

I think it is perfectly fine for folks to have different opinions about tactics or strategies. Sometimes that makes us stronger, widens our base, helps us diversify. This is clearly not the case here because you only offer criticism, no solutions.

Oh, and how down right pathetic to take blows at Roey! Someone wanted to know how Roey stays in power? Read my next sentence clearly, becasue this is how leaders are supposed to do it. Roey doesn't horde power, she builds power and empowers people to be engaged in the struggle. You should be thanking Roey, not trying to bring her down because you can't do better.

[LT]

What an interesting discussion. Dissent? Never! No involvement? No opinions allowed.

Best minds? ACLU ran the legal strategy that ended in being handed their heads by the state supreme court. And while PFLAG has many useful functions, a collection of bare-knuckled political operative it isn't.

North of Oregon, Hands Off Washington frittered away a great brand ID with dumb political moves and a board that valued marching in lockstep to skilled management and fundraising. It's successor's leaders decided, pretty much among themselves, to float an inititative on nondiscrimination. They held rallies and got all revved up because politicians came and said nice things while not really putting any resources into the fray. The unions in Washington supported the initiative, for example, but put no members out door to door. One of the national groups ostentatiously sent out a field organizer and everyone had a Sally Field moment, feeling they were truly loved.

And in due course the initative got crushed, 60-40.

When I see an organization whose supporters respond to criticism by attacking the critic as "pathetic," I generally say to myself, "well now, there's a group that's already got so much brain power on hand, they don't need someone like me to ask the occasional question about whether a strategy on which the rights of so many hang could be improved at all."

Good luck, all you clever lads! Oregon is lucky you have got everything figured out to a fare-thee-well.

[Beth Allen]

Note to the self-professed luminary of the Worldwide Pablum:

Every civil rights movement succeeds through incremental change. Roey gets that and she's working like hell to push each increment as far and hard as she can, with the help of a lot of enthusiastic, smart, optimistic people who recognize her talent and leadership.

By all means, remain cranky and independent, and stubbornly unrealistic. We need all types in this world. Me? I think I'll go back to working towards positive change, even if it means I won't get everything I want, just the way I want it, when I want it.

[Chuck Currie]

Bryan. Some words of wisdom. You might consider knowing the history and character of those you are so quick to dismiss. Portland is lucky to have someone willing to raise the red flags and remind people that the history of “separate but equal” is always just separate and unequal. Paul’s words might be a little strong but his point is on target. It can be beneficial to let people who have been involved in this fight - and who risked much at times – offer advice that puts the current moment into perspective.

[Worldwide Pablo]

Dear Beth, your comment qualifies as the most cogent response of the day. As always, you shine where so many others dare to dimly glow. Thanks for weighing in.

Speaking of weighing in, WWP will do so tomorrow -- and not as a rebuke or a rebuttal, by the way, but hopefully as a summation and survey of what unites, and what divides, all those who care so deeply about this topic.

Meanwhile, keep the comments coming -- even the invective. WWP is a true believer in the marketplace of ideas [even if others by their deeds and words demonstrate so clearly that they are not], and he deeply cares about your feedback and welcomes the unfettered free-speech that is sure to continue.

[Richard]

>Her position is indefensible - and the more she has to talk about it, the more the public realizes she is blocking the vote because she is anti-gay.<

Huh? Karen is anti-happy?

[Roey Thorpe]

I guess that since these comments are about me and Basic Rights Oregon, I ought to respond. I appreciate a variety of viewpoints about strategy, and ideas and criticism are always welcome and often inform our discussions and decisions. In fact, I believe that our movement is not healthy without these kinds of disagreements--it keeps us vital, thinking, and on our toes.

What troubles me about your post, Paul, is the tone of it. It sounds like you think I'm stupid and possibly some kind of lazy figurehead who encourages people to worship me. I don't think I'm any of those things, although I am definitely fallible and would be happy to have a frank and open discussion with you about what I think my best and worst decisions have been. But make no mistake--Basic Rights Oregon is the work of a team of the most dedicated, talented staff and volunteers that I've ever met, and anyone who thinks that the organization is all me, all the time, is not seeing the truth about how all of the work we're doing gets done.

So let me ask this, not just of you but of all of us who care about lgbt rights: Isn't there a way for us to share criticism without tearing down other people who are part of our own movement? Especially when we don't know those people, as you don't know me. Isn't there a way to respect the individuals, the organizations, and the work itself while at the same time disagreeing with direction and strategy decisions that have been made? Can't we believe that passionate, dedicated people can disagree and learn from one another? And can we also believe that smart people can disagree and still be smart?

You accuse me of playing into the hands of our opponents. I could argue back just as easily that the accusatory and derisive tone of your post does that even more clearly. But really, I know that you don't mean for that to happen, and that it is only true if I allow our difference of opinion to make me view you as my enemy instead of my ally. Even though it was hard for me to see you as my ally after reading your words, I know that you are, and that we are ultimately on the same team.

I hope that as a movement, we don't blame our losses on all of us who are working so hard for social change, but rather, on how difficult the task is of changing people's homophobic, bigoted attitudes. Criticism of tactics is one thing, placing blame on each other is another. It not only wears away at the people on the frontlines of our movement, but it scares away people who might want to get involved but don't want to open themselves up to internal vitriol.

Finally, I'll just tell you that I'm actually a pretty smart cookie when it comes to Political Science 101, and even if I wasn't, I'm surrounded by lots of people who are smarter than me! So I invite you to give me a call--503-222-6151--and talk about what you're concerned about. You might be pleasantly surprised, you might not. I suspect that you and I have more in common than we have differences, and I'm always up for a strategy discussion with someone who cares about our movement.

[Joe D]

Pablo,
You are so far off the mark it is sad. If you look back at any civil rights movement in our history, it has played out in a very similar way. Those in power play any games they can to keep the oppressed, oppressed. When Martin Luther King marched in Selma and the Southern White Politicians stood firm, it strengthened their power base such as the KKK. The oppressed had to fight their cause for YEARS before changed happened. It was always one step forward, three steps backward. However, it was persistence and the will not to give up that ultimately made the difference. Roey and BRO are doing exactly what they should do.

Eventually Strom Thurmond apologized for being wrong. Karen Minnis will eventually do the same.